JoomlaWorks

96 comments

• torkilj 04 Jun 2011
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  Not having a functioning FTP layer is of course bad, but I'm not sure I'd call the nobody user a security feature though…
  
• mstroven 31 May 2011
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  I drank the J1.6 koolaide early on, and have survived to regret it. My hosting system assigns the linux user "nobody" to all scripts for security purposes. For this reason, I use the Joomla FTP layer for all uploading of new components, modules, etc., as well as new content. Well, the FTP layer is BROKEN in J1.6, and apparently has no scheduled fix date. This is an absolute show-stopper for me. I'm going back to J1.5 100% and checking out Nooku!
  
• torkilj 09 Feb 2011
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  @Abhijeet: Nooku has nothing to do with "huge enterprise level". Nooku is excellent for everything from the smallest of modules to the largest of components. It's just a lot better than the Joomla Framework. K2 would benefit greatly from it.
  
• kurchania 07 Feb 2011
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  Hello Fotis,
  it give a little confidence that K2 for Joomla 1.6 will be released around april.
  but please remember one thing that all our data of k2 is very vital. we also need to migrate our data of k2 from joomla 1.5 to joomla 1.6
  jupgrade is kind of nightmare right now.changes in core xml give extra burden to every developer to upgrade this stuff.
  @nikosdion when joomla team change joomla core like this without giving any support to legacy plugin everyone of us have to explore alternate option. its really hard to maintain system.
  for huge enterprise level application nooku is excellent framework.
  Regards
  Abhijeet
  
• morktron 07 Feb 2011
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  Very interesting posts! I'm sticking with J1.5 and K2 for now since pretty much anything can be done.

  A chap called Simon has written some code so you can actually have restricted frontend categories in K2 - http://community.getk2.org/forum/topics/use-k2usergroup-variable-in-a" rel="nofollow">http://community.getk2.org/forum/topics/use-k2usergroup-variable-in-a

  Hopefully this will be included in the next version of K2...

  Keep up the good work!

  
  
• nikosdion 06 Feb 2011
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  Stop spreading this incredible FUD about Nooku. There are three distinct "Nookus" out there:
  1. Nooku Content, the translation manager. That's as commercial as it can get.
  2. Nooku Server, the Joomla 1.5 distro/fork/whatever you call it. That's free, but it's aimed at enterprise-grade websites
  3. Nooku Framework (Koowa). This is a perfectly free framework, distributed unter the GNU GPL. Extension made on top of it integrate perfectly with Joomla 1.5 and 1.6 without changing a single line of code.

  I can't see why a K2 version build on top of Koowa would be the end of a free and open source K2. On the contrary! If Fotis had used Koowa to build K2, we wouldn't be having this discussion now. You'd just install the K2 package on Joomla 1.6 and be done with it. In the end of the day, the Nooku framework (Koowa) is just another PHP framework, which happens to integrate nicely with Joomla.

  Think about it in another way. Many of you are using JomSocial on your sites. Have you ever realized that JomSocial DOES NOT use the Joomla framework? Nope. It uses the Zend Framework. Just because Azrul doesn't advertise that fact, it doesn't mean that it's not a fact. Have any of you opposed so vehemently to JomSocial using Zend FW instead of the J! FW just like you do with this K2/Nooku idea? Nope. Why is that? What is of your biggest interest, how the code is written or whether you can use it to build the sites you want to build? If it's the former, stop talking and start coding. If it's the latter, why are you trolling? Let the man write the code you are not interested in writing yourself on any framework he chooses to do so.

  For the love of Christ, we're discussing about allowing a GPL developer to use other GPL software! Where's the sense in that?

  
  
• Fotis Evangelou 06 Feb 2011
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  The last couple of posts where entirely off-topic and misleading the least (if not flame bursting)...

  The community of K2 has spoken through the poll I got up on: http://community.getk2.org/#pollFor16" rel="nofollow">http://community.getk2.org/#pollFor16

  The verdict? Existing K2 users are not rushing to jump to Joomla 1.6, especially knowing it's got a limited life-cycle (up until July 2011). And this is normal. All those who don't agree, please accept the voice of the majority...

  What does that mean for K2?

  It means the following 2 things:
  1. We will proceed and launch v2.5 of K2 for Joomla 1.5 only within February 2011. New features and especially performance improvements of up to 500% make this release a very important one to existing websites, especially the most high traffic ones...
  2. We will proceed to port K2 for Joomla 1.6 and release v2.6 within April (or hopefully sooner) so new Joomla 1.6 users make use of the incredibly valuable content features K2 adds to Joomla.

  In the meantime, we will explore other options as well, like perhaps a bundled Joomla & K2 distribution based on Nooku Server. Johan Janssens has given us his "blessings", so if time permits, we will explore this option as well.

  What all that means?

  It mean K2 has a vibrant and high-level community of people who value their content and know their priorities. Evolution itself demands we move forward (I never said the opposite either way). So we ARE moving forward.

  Thanks to everyone who participated in this blog post with their comments or even via Twitter or other social services.

  Thanks to all the K2 users that voted as well.

  
  
• torkilj 06 Feb 2011
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  It's one thing to complain about J1.6 (we all do!), it's another to prefer to use Nooku Framework for development instead.

  Nooku has a much more solid and flexible foundation (framework) at it's core, which makes features like ACL or nested categories much easier to develop and maintain. In my opinion, and as the person who makes strategic decisions like CMS/framework choice for our company, I put my money on Nooku for the future.

  Did you for instance know that you in any Nooku based component can call and display a view from a different component? Nooku has a RESTful architecture and that an OAuth server/client pair is being worked on as we speak? Imagine the possibilities…

  Or see for yourself in the demo of Anahita for instance:
  http://www.anahitapolis.com/" rel="nofollow">http://www.anahitapolis.com/

  Or Ohanah:
  http://www.ohanah.com/" rel="nofollow">http://www.ohanah.com/

  Or Nooku Desktop:
  http://bambuser.com/channel/Svenska+Joomlaf%C3%B6reningen" rel="nofollow">http://bambuser.com/channel/Svenska+Joomlaf%C3%B6reningen

  Like Marco Barbosa said: "Nooku Desktop changes everything".

  
  
• torkilj 06 Feb 2011
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  Those are interesting links :)

  Nooku Server will be both multi-site and multi-lingual when it's released in May, hopefully in time to be demoed at JAB 11. It is a stripped down version of Joomla 1.5 with all the unnecessary and legacy stuff removed, and a lot of other stuff rewritten to use Nooku Framework. It will also come bundled with a new admin template and with Nooku Framework of course.

  Meanwhile, the lead developer behind Joomla 1.6 has written a 3 page long article trying to explain the fundamental question of "should I update to J1.6", and his conclusion is "it depends". On the question of "is it stable?", the diplomatic response is that "we don't call it stable, we call it GA, or General Availability", and "no software is bug free".

  Doesn't that say it all?

  
  
• jimmybang 06 Feb 2011
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  When should site owners upgrade to Joomla 1.6?
  http://www.theartofjoomla.com/home/5-commentary/133-when-should-site-owners-upgrade-to-joomla-16.html" rel="nofollow">http://www.theartofjoomla.com/home/5-commentary/133-when-should-site-owners-u...
  
• jimmybang 06 Feb 2011
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  Nooku beta is not due until May.
  http://blog.nooku.org/2011/01/a-roadmap-for-nooku-server/" rel="nofollow">http://blog.nooku.org/2011/01/a-roadmap-for-nooku-server/
  
• torkilj 06 Feb 2011
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  Nothing. The image is related to and supposed to reflect the sexiness of Nooku Server.
  
• arechsteiner 06 Feb 2011
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  What does this sexy female body on top of the page have to do with Joomla 1.6?
  
• torkilj 06 Feb 2011
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  Come on guys. The only reason K2 came to be in the first place is because Joomla the CMS sucks at the CMS part. If Joomla was a kick-ass product, K2 would not have a raison d'être. The same thing can be said about Nooku Framework: If the Joomla Framework would have evolved after 1.5 to something better, then the Nooku Framework would not have been as easy to sell to Joomla developers.

  Face it: Joomla the CMS and Joomla the FW has been surpassed by both it's competitors and it's fledgelings. What are you going to do about it? Well, we're reading now about what Fotis has decided to do, and he's not an innovator in that regard, but he may very well be an early adopter. Will you be a laggard? If you're basing your business on Joomla, like Fotis is doing, this is something you need to think about.
  http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Diffusion_of_innovations" rel="nofollow">http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Diffusion_of_innovations

  If you're relying *solely* on Joomla for business, you're relying on a product that's become outdated. It's floating along on it's large userbase, but it's still outdated. The vast amount of CCKs and frameworks now available for Joomla is a testament to that, not to mention that core developers themselves have plain and simple admitted to it. See my blog post of August last year on the topic, with links to relevant discussions and statements: http://www.torkiljohnsen.com/2010/08/13/taking-joomla-forward/" rel="nofollow">http://www.torkiljohnsen.com/2010/08/13/taking-joomla-forward/

  @intercisa: No, Nooku Framework is not built on top of the Joomla Framework. From a Joomla viewpoint, Nooku Framework can be described like this in one sentence:

  "A tool for Joomla developers to reduce the amount of code they need to write by 80%".

  It's not for huge CMS government sites; it's for extension developers, like Fotis here. It makes it easier and less time consuming for them to create great products, not to mention how much lighter and more easily maintainable those products will be.

  This is also the main reason why for instance the developers of a great product called JomSocial decided to ditch the Joomla Framework in favor of the Zend Framework, as a basis for their component. JomSocial is still Joomla compatible though, probably because Joomla, with it's huge userbase, is a great ecosystem to make money it. Hell, even people.joomla.org runs on JomSocial. How's that for irony?

  Conclusion: More and more extensions will in the future be driven by other frameworks. Previously I would also add "…unless Joomla get's it's act together", but that's something I've given up on a long time ago. Nooku is the framework closest related to Joomla that you can find—it even has the same lead developer. Therefore, it's easy to migrate from being Joomla developers to becoming Nooku developers.

  For the time being, Nooku is Joomla compatible and Nooku Server (a Joomla 1.5 distro really) has 99% backwards compatibility with Joomla 1.5. So migration from Joomla 1.5 to Nooku Server would be a lot easier than to migrate to another CMS.

  Nooku is basically the easiest way out for a Joomla developer who wants to write better code in less time, to create more awesome products.

  
  
• alpineweb 06 Feb 2011
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  All of you who are bellyaching that Fotis isn't going to provide a 1.6 compatible version of K2 need to get off of his ass! If it were you spending the 500+ hours needed to recreate what is already the best damn Joomla extension ever developed and distributed for FREE, you would be equally hesitant to put in the time if in 5 months there is yet going to be another flavor of Joomla. I wholeheartedly support Fotis in holding off, why fix what is not broken with the k2 for 1.5. I certainly support continued development on the 1.5 version of K2 to make IT better with added functionality, but don't waste the time until after 1.7. If I do decide to build with 1.6, I will sadly do it without K2 but will not be angry due to its lack of compatibility. I pretty much do everything with K2 but if I can't, it's not going to stop me from developing a site for a paid client. I would certainly like to see better front-end access to K2 so clients do not have to use the admin side to add articles, but this has not been a show stopper.

  Put it another way, K2 is FREE! If we all want to pay Fotis, say $100 per site to license it for use, then hell yeah, Fotis should have already had K2 for 1.6 ready to go and he would have done it I'm sure, with a smile. So get off his ass, be a developer (if you can really work with code), stop whining like little baies in need of a tit and show a little love and respect to the guys that do all of the heavy lifting for free so the rest of us look good! I trust Fotis and company have a firm, realistic grasp on where Joomla is heading and trust their decision implicitly.

  
  
• marnijderr 05 Feb 2011
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  I have to agree with you Leigh. I'm no developer, but I am a happy Joomla and extension user. I would also like to see a more painless and transparent upgrade like WordPress. They introduce new features and there is no panic on the end of the user, and there shouldn't be. Graceful upgrade paths, that seems to be key.

  I'm all for improvement and extension support. I like Joomla because it is more robust than Wordpress, but it is easy for a novice to use. I like the CCK to be separate, and all the other extensions too, because if you begin to add that many layers of complexity to Joomla it becomes Drupal and you remove a huge part of the audience that can use it.

  It would be nice if as users and developers like Joomlaworks we could have a positive influence on the future Joomla development. :)

  
  
• aravotaravot 05 Feb 2011
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  Basicly Nooku Server is FORK of Joomla 1.5
  
• Leigh Godson 05 Feb 2011
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  From the standpoint of end user - one of those that rely heavily on K2 for site function - but also a number of other Joomla components the whole J1.6 affair is one giant cock up IMO and is perhaps even more so than J1.0-1.5 which is a lesson that should have been learned from by now...

  First up no-one seems to be on the same page with extensions being ready, any normal entity trying to promote their 'latest and greatest' model would have at least been behind its addon developers to encourage their products be ready for the launch date but not Joomla it seems which is -1 point for professionalism. On the same hand though Joomlaworks have posted in the past that once J1.6 is launched a K2 version would indeed be ready and this current issue - while potentially quite a valid argument brews beneath all this - seems to be more of a power tussle where end users are the ones in the middle, suffering. -1 for Joomlaworks.

  To start at the very beginning, Joomla used to be a CMS where you could go to the extensions database, find the product you wanted and install it without much of a worry about framework incompatibilities or the like, nowadays is atrocious for the end user - I am really not exaggerating here too, you have umpteen javascript frameworks all incompatible with each other and all taking precious resources to load for each user - who of course is not guaranteed to be able to support said scripts and so on. Joomla need to get a grip on its API and tighten up the way developers do things for the greater good - perhaps this is not possible, I dont know as I am no developer - just one of those lowly end users that I THOUGHT Joomla was based around.

  After the fight with script and framework I want to settle in with a nice mug of cocoa and upgrade my J1.5 install to the new version - where is the built in, carefully thought out migration process? You know- the one where you click a button, watch the migrator do its thing and then spit out a fully operational J1.6 site that works and all software is either managed in a legacy plugin at the very least but preferably 1.6 ready... Seriously this is and has been the biggest oversight in this whole J1.6 launch as far as I am concerned.

  Sorry simple non-developer, end user types with a Joomla1.5 based site, you are not welcome into J1.6 unless you are willing to go back in and put another - 1 month, 2 month, 3 month ______ (Enter your own timeframe here) worth of work to get back to the stability you have already fought long and hard for.

  From one developer telling you that their product is perfect and you should speak to Mr X at X company about their plugin which has caused this to happen to Mr Y at Y companies component you go round and round in circles trying to get your damn components to at least talk nicely to each other which is what I thought the purpose of Joomla as a CMS was or am I wrong?

  From day dot I am have shown no interest in upgrading to J1.6 because for me J1.0-1.5 was enough to put me off and although I had hoped this would not be repeated it seems that rather than getting a product FULLY ready for prime time, multi-million site use the Joomla team have released another rolling public beta with missing feature set.

  
  
• intercisa 05 Feb 2011
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  @PufferMedia Thank you!
  
• lcdservices 05 Feb 2011
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  i'm glad to see the poll as a way to get more input from users.

  personally, i think the original blog post reveals short-sightedness. v1.6 is the path forward. it's not as though 1.7, 1.8, etc. will backtrack from v1.6 -- the whole point of a time-based release is to avoid huge steps forward that necessitate rebuilding things, in favor of smaller, incremental steps forward that are more easily manageable. but to say that you're going to "skip" 1.6 in favor of future releases seems silly. the investment of time into the new and continually evolving structure will need to happen; 1.7+ will be based on 1.6. so why not begin investing the time now?

  and i have to say -- you're perspective on the new ACL features seems way off base. ACL has been the biggest roadblock to Joomla competing on an enterprise level with Drupal. anyone who has used Drupal or done an enterprise level site that requires strict access permissions knows the importance and value of a solid ACL structure. i think the Joomla solution is well thought out and will open the doors to important opportunities. to write it off the way you did is disturbing.